Why you can’t argue with an meat eater!

Of course, I could just as well have substituted meat eater for religious, racist, misogynist… Why, do you say? In short, it comes down to values.

Let me give you a few examples. If you want to discuss whether or not God exists – do you think it would be a good idea to list proof that God doesn’t exists? Probably not, because if you’re a faithful believer proof isn’t part of the equation. Either you believe or you don’t, as simple as that.

Let me give a similar example with another belief system – racism. The racists in this example truly believe that black people have less intelligence than white people. They even provide proof that they have smaller brains. Would that matter? Probably not, because in your belief system there isn’t any difference in intelligence between these two groups. And the racists believe that it’s true. Would you two have a fruitful discussion? The most likely outcome is that at least one of you will walk away in anger and no one would have changed their minds.

Now, I’ll go back to where I started, with the meat eater – or omnivore which is a better description, since no human is a carnivore like, for instance, a lion. In this example this omnivore will discuss the matter about eating meat with a vegan. The omnivore truly believes it’s ok to eat the flesh of another living creature as long as it’s one of the animals that is classified as a provider of meat. Where this line goes is a bit blurry, but it could be cows and pigs, but not dogs. The vegan truly believes that it’s not right to eat the flesh of any other living creature. Would a discussion about veganism be fruitful between these two? Would either of them change their minds after the discussion? Probably not.

I realize that there are different kinds of vegans, but in this case I’m talking about ethical vegans (which is the normal definition of vegan – ethical strict vegetarian). I’m sure an omnivore would have a fair shot in the discussion with someone who is vegan only for health reasons, providing facts about health issues. And the vegan might have a shot if the omnivore has mixed feelings of eating meat, but perhaps believes it might not be healthy to change or s/he might be afraid that his/her knowledge wouldn’t be enough for a change.

In any case, take a look at yourself. Why do you want to engage in a discussion with someone whose values are completely different from yours? If the reason is to learn about how other people think, then go for it. That’s usually why I discuss with religious people (about religion). To understand them better. Their belief system is so far removed from my own.

If the reason is that you’re frustrated with how things are – that’s usually why I engage in discussions with omnivores (about meat eating) – then think twice. Do you really think you can change their values? If not, perhaps you should step away. You’ll only end up even more frustrated.

If the reason is that you want to ridicule the other person, think again. One day you’ll meet someone that’s better at it.

Values is the key here. They are so much harder to change, both for yourself and for the one you are talking with. Accept them as they are. At least for the time being. Not because you think they are doing the right thing. In my case, there are days when I just want to shake some sense into them, to make them see that they are eating sentient beings that have just as much right to live as they do. And there are days when I still cry over all the poor animals that suffer and die because some people want to eat their flesh. I still wish for a peaceful world where animals and humans can live in peace side by side. But that Utopia is so far away. No matter how much I want it to happen, arguments won’t change the values of other people. At least not in the short run. In time, I hope that things will change.

Instead, try just showing them a good example. Show them that it’s alright to hang out with people from another country. They are just like you and me. Show them that it’s perfectly healthy to eat vegan food, that it’s just as tasty and tell them about how individual your pets are. That they get sad and happy just as you do. Show them that gay people are no different from others.

Unfortunately, at the moment, that’s all you can do. Just do what’s right, set a good example and hope for the best.

More online communities

At one time or another I’ve been on most of the major social networks (MySpace, HI5 and Friendster). I suppose I liked MySpace the best, but in the end, I left (twice). I read somewhere that it’s a bit like coming to a major central railway station hoping to meet people. It won’t work. You’ll need to get to know them from somewhere else or get someone you know already to introduce you. That’s very true. I never made any friends, and the only contacts I really had were with people I knew from somewhere else.

Ning is a social network for – creating social networks. You get to have your own network or networks. It’s really quite cool. You get most features that you get on other social networks, but this one is all yours and you can customize it, invite the members you like etc. There’s a photo gallery feature, a chat room, a forum and a blog among other things. You can also add widgets – little mini programs that can do all kinds of things.

My favorite social networks are special interest sites. Some of them will undoubtedly be interests you don’t share, so you’ll just have to skip them.

First of all, I’m a vegan, animal lover and animal rights advocate. I’m also concerned about the environment.

One of the biggest’green’ social networks I’ve joined, is Care2. You can get a free webmail address, a photo album with unlimited storage – limited per month, send virtual e-cards that help save the rainforest, join groups (some of them are very active), sign online petitions, click to generate free donations and much more. There are also many interesting articles about all kinds of causes – the environment, politics, human rights, animal rights (they call it *welfare* and that’s one of the things I don’t like so much about it) etc. You also get a profile page you can customize. Recently, they added a sort of payment system where you can earn ‘credits’ and then use them to pay for something or other, for instance, give a cup of clean water to a Haitian child. When you’ve donated or redeemed your credits or signed a petition you can tweet it to your friends or share it some other way. Care2 makes sharing easy.

I’ve also joined several vegan and animal rights sites. Feel free to ignore this bit.

VegSpace
VeganWorld
VeganForce
Vegppl
AnimalRights Community Online

So far I haven’t made any new friends at any of these, so maybe I shouldn’t even have recommended them, but for me it’s important to be a part of the veg*an community. I like them, but they feel very much like MySpace except with a cause I can relate to. I’ve also joined several vegan dating sites. (You can specify you’re just looking for friends, if that’s what you want). I’ve actually made a few friends that way, but unfortunately, just like all other friends, online or otherwise, some have drifted away. It’s been quite a long time since I made any new friends, so maybe the sites have changed or rather the people using them. In fact, though I’m still single, I’m not really looking for dates online anymore. In any case, these are the ones I’ve tried:

VeggieConnection
VeggieDate.org
VeganPassions (there are many other passions sites – for just about any interest you might have) and you don’t have to look for a partner, just friends will do.

Since i’m an animal lover, I’m also a member of several sites for animal lovers.

Petster
Dogster
Catster
Bunspace

You get to upload photos, fill out a profile page, mainly for your baby, but also for yourself – on Petster. On Catster and Dogster there are also plenty of articles about cats or dogs and groups with forums for people who love the same type of animals you do.

Social networks

I thought I’d continue my computer/internet “school”. This time I’d like to get into social networks, the ones I like best.

Since I’m a vegan, animal and human rights advocate and so on, Care2 is one of my favorite sites. It’s a social network for people who ‘care’. Features include free email, messaging, free e cards that help save rainforest and free donations. There are also groups that you can create and/or join. There’s even an instant messaging service. You also get a personal profile page that you can customize, where you can add photos, movies etc.

There are several veggie related communities – CrueltyFree, Vegan World, VegSpace. They’re all nice, but don’t feel very active. Maybe I haven’t really gotten to know them well enough yet. You get a profile page, messaging etc.

For other specialized interests I can mention LiveJournal and Vox. LiveJournal is a community that evolves around blogging/journal writing. Vox is quite similar to LJ, but here you get to upload media – photos, movies, music etc.

Speaking of media – Zooomr is a very cool photo site. You get unlimited storage space and hotlinking is allowed – that means you can store your photos, then link to them on your blog, profile page, home page etc.

If you’re into animals there are several different networking sites intended for animal lovers. Petster is for people with all kinds of pets. Catster is for cat lovers and Dogster is for dog lovers. There are others – BunSpace is another example, but the basic level doesn’t really allow you to do anything, so I can’t tell you much about it.

For those of us who are passionate about our writing, there are online archives where you can post your stories and poems and hopefully get comments. Naturally, you can also look for things to read.

FanFiction.net is probably the main site for fan fiction enthusiasts, but there are others – FanWorks is another I can mention. There you can also upload artwork.
FictionPress is for original fiction.

Finally, I’d like to mention a language learning network – LiveMocha. I’ve only started using the site so I can’t tell you all that much, but so far it looks impressive. You can learn new languages or practice one you already know and get help from native speakers.